Brahmin bridegrooms not getting brides

[Venkatesh Murthy]

Namaste

One year back also I wrote in below article the great difficulty of
Vaidika Brahmins living in rural places in getting brides. The brides
are interested in comfortable city life like going to picnics, eating
in hotels and other nice things. The fathers of girls also want the
daughters to marry high tech employed boys. They want the daughters to
marry some foreign settled guy and settle there. They are refusing to
give daughters to Vaidika Brahmins and they want only high tech
salaried boys. It is very difficult for Vaidika educated boys to get
girls. But even very traditional boys living in cities are struggling
to find suitable girls because the girls working in companies with
them are very modern thinking. They will not follow the family
traditions and make the in laws very upset. They will not obey in-laws
and the rules of the husband's house.

This is all happening because the Brahmin women are becoming more and
more modern looking and thinking like Westerners. If this situation
continues the Vaidika Brahmin tradition will become very weak and die.
It is weak even now but it may become extinct. One friend told me even
Mattur Brahmin boys are not getting brides. In one traditional
matrimonial centre they called eligible Brahmin bachelors and brides
to attend the match making programme. Almost 200 bachelors came but
only 2 brides came. This is a pathetic situation. Who will marry the
198 bachelors? If the Vaidikas are not able to marry and get children
the Brahmin population will decrease rapidly. They must be given
chance to marry and have children and spread the Vaidika tradition.

One Badaganadu Brahmin named Vasudeva Murthy told me Sringeri Swami
Sri Bharati Teertha has given advice to Brahmin boys to marry
vegetarian brides from other castes if they don't get Brahmins. Is
this a correct approach? What is the Dharma Sastra support for this
approach? Kindly explain.

अद्यतनयुवकाः परंपरागतं स्वस्वकुलस्य वृत्तिम् अनिच्छंतः केवलं
धनेन्द्रियसुखप्राप्त्यर्थं ऐ.टी.-बी.टी. इत्यादि उच्चतान्त्रिक है.टेक्.
वृत्तिमेव कुर्वन्ति । प्रायः ग्रामीणप्रदेशीययुवकाः ग्रामान् त्यक्त्वा
बेन्गलूरुचेन्नै-आदिनगारेषु उद्योगान् कुर्वन्ति वसन्ति च ।
ग्रामीणप्रदेशीयकन्याः अपि नगरेषु लभ्यसुखानां कामनाभिः चोदिताः
ग्रामीणप्रदेशीय वरान् परिणेतुं न इच्छन्ति किंतु नगरस्थान् वरानेव |
कोऽपि पिता स्वकन्यां ग्रामस्थवराय दातुं न सिद्धो भवति । इयं
बृहत्समस्या ब्राह्मणवरान् पीडयति । समस्यायाः किंचित् समाधानं करणीयम् ।
शृगेरीमठाधीशाः श्रीभारतीतीर्थस्वामिनः एवम् समस्यापीडितेभ्यः
स्मार्तब्राह्मणेभ्यो वरेभ्यः उपदिशन्ति यूयं रामानुजमध्वादिमतस्थकन्याम् अपि
मांसभक्षणादिव्यसनरहिताम् अन्यवर्णामपि कन्यां वा स्वीकुरुत इति । इति
मया वार्ता श्रूयते इदं सत्यं वा न जानामि । अत्र
ब्राह्मणविवाहसमस्याविषये विदुषाम् अभिप्रायान् श्रोतुमिच्छामि ।

धन्यवादः

-वेङ्कटेशः


On Wed, Jun 27, 2012 at 4:09 PM, Venkata sriram P
<***@yahoo.in> wrote:
> Just out of the topic, hope again this won't spin off several posts !
>
> This is regarding a famous sampradAya pravachanAchArya in Andhra Pradesh (name withheld for privacy).
>
> The nephew of this acharya is a doctor by profession who holds post-doctoral degree and an accomplished surgeon.  He is a doctor who doesn't care for money and performs operations free of cost to the poor people.  Also takes nominal fee in clinics.  His intention is to uplift rural areas and make them aware of health & sanitation.
>
> Apart from his profession, he performs regular sandhyAvandana, shiva panchAyatana pUja, brahma yajna & swAdhyAya daily.
>
> For the past 5 years he has been searching for a suitable girl to marry but none of the
> brahmin families are willing to give away their daughters to this person.
>
> Do you why?
>
> The conditions of this doctor who is a sadAchAri are the girl should observe:
>
> 1. Should observe rajaswala niyamAs strictly as per the dharma sindhu
> 2. No parties / outing
> 3. No cinemas
> 4. No onions / garlic in food
> 5. Should assit him in cooking mahAnaivEdya daily for dEvatArchana
>
> Having listened to these conditions, none of the educated girls are willing to marry him.
>
> This poor doctor has been waiting for a suitable match for the past 5 years with a hope !
>
> sriram
> _______________________________________________
> Archives: http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/archives/advaita-l/
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--
Regards

-Venkatesh
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For assi

[Vidyasankar Sundaresan]

>
> This is all happening because the Brahmin women are becoming more and
> more modern looking and thinking like Westerners. If this situation
> continues the Vaidika Brahmin tradition will become very weak and die.

While on this subject, let us be very honest and acknowledge that a lot of
this situation is self-made by brAhmaNa communities all over. Traditional
conceptions of strIdharma vary a lot from region to region, but over the
last century, no effort has been made to educate boys and girls about the
requirements of dharma. When brAhmaNa men who are supposed to be
exemplars of certain qualities have, by and large, abandoned their own
heritage for other pursuits, and do not even do the basic minimum, how
fair is it to expect that only their women should follow all the rules in strict
conformity? Swami Vivekananda made the observation that we relegate
our dharma to the kitchen. More than a hundred years later, women do
not want to be relegated to the kitchen either, so if anybody is to share
the major portion of the blame, it is the category of brAhmaNa males,
nobody else.

> One Badaganadu Brahmin named Vasudeva Murthy told me Sringeri Swami
> Sri Bharati Teertha has given advice to Brahmin boys to marry
> vegetarian brides from other castes if they don't get Brahmins. Is
> this a correct approach? What is the Dharma Sastra support for this
> approach? Kindly explain.

Well, one can sit around wringing one's hands and bemoaning the fall of
brAhmaNa dharma, or one can make use the dharmaSAstra rule that allows
marriages between brAhmaNa men and women of any caste. It is called
anuloma vivAha, while the marriage of a brAhmaNa born woman with a
man of another caste is called pratiloma. There are lots of instances going
back all the way to the very beginning of the brAhmaNa gotras - jamadagni's
wife, the mother of paraSurAma, was a kshatriya girl. sukanyA, who married
cyavana, was also the daughter of a king. Every brAhmaNa today who belongs
to a gotra beginning with bhRgu in the pravara has had a kshatriya female
ancestor in the remote past. satyavatI, the mother of veda vyAsa, was a
fisherman's daughter, while dhRtarAshTra and pANDu, biological sons of
vyAsa, were kshatriya and vidura, another biological son of vyAsa, was
considered SUdra. The varNa of a person has always been a complicated
matter and there has really never ben anybody who could have claimed
that all his relatives belonged to the same varNa as himself.

In one of the 8 recognized forms of marriage, a yajamAna could offer a
daughter in marriage to the purohita, as part of the dakshiNA for the ritual.
There is no specification in the dharmaSAstra-s that such a yajamAna also
had to be a brAhmaNa. In the upanishad that teaches the samvarga vidyA,
jAnaSruti pautrAyana gave his daughter to raikva. jAnaSruti was a kshatriya
too. raikva called him a SUdra, but did not reject his offer of a daughter in
marriage. There is one well known instance of pratiloma marriage in the
epics - yayAti, a king, married devayAnI, the daughter of Sukra, and they
were the ancestors of almost everybody in the mahAbhArata, including the
pANdava-s, the dhArtarAshTra-s, karNa, bhIshma and kRshNa too.

All this shows that there is a long dhArmika history behind what the Sringeri
Acharya has suggested. Having said this, let me say something else. Asking
the question, "is this a correct approach?" is superfluous and the paragraphs
I've written above are totally unnecessary. If Sringeri Acharya recommends
a course of action, you can rest assured that it is in accordance with dharma,
by default. There is no need to second guess it and seek further justification.
I have only offered the above details for the sake of the general discussion.
At a personal level, if one has a question about dharma and one approaches
a guru for advice, then one needs to have the requisite SraddhA in the guru
and the advice that he gives. The words of a Sankaracharya are not things
in the market place to be bought, tested and returned or thrown away if one
doesn't like them.

In Tamil, we say, this is not "kattarikkai vyApAram".

As a practical matter for today, let me just add this. I sincerely hope that a
brahmAna boy who is observant about his duties and the girl he marries from
another community really work at keeping their marriage intact and make it
work through the long years they have to live together, rather than resort to
the easy legal option of divorce that is used willy-nilly nowadays, when the
going gets tough, as it invariably will, at one time or the other.

Regards,
Vidyasankar

[V Subrahmanian]

On Wed, Jun 27, 2012 at 10:57 PM, Vidyasankar Sundaresan <
svidyasankar-***@public.gmane.org> wrote:

> The varNa of a person has always been a complicated
> matter and there has really never been anybody who could have claimed
> that all his relatives belonged to the same varNa as himself.
>

It is very true. One can never be sure, maybe beyond three generations
backwards about the varNa of one's ancestors unless family tree records are
maintained. Someone known to me, a brahmin, has a close relative who has
married a non-brahmin girl. He says: after six years of her living in this
house, she gets the varNa of this family. I do not know if there is any
scriptural support for this. In any case, I am also told that some
Peethadhipathis have said that brahmin boys may marry vaishya girls if
there is no other option. But then what varNa does the offspring get? I
suppose there are some specific varNa names for the offspring of such
marriages. I remember to have seen some of these names in the
Br.Up.Bhashya/or gloss. Someone may pl. show that.

subrahmanian.v


>

[Sunil Bhattacharjya]

Namaste,


In the same vein one may aske what was the Varna of the sage Vedavyasa, who had a brahmin father (Parashara) and a Kaivarta mother (Matsyagandha turned Satyavati).

Regards,
Sunil KB



________________________________
From: V Subrahmanian <v.subrahmanian-***@public.gmane.org>
To: A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta <advaita-l-4gKAAF5ltrLLd2BZh+9d9q/***@public.gmane.org.org>
Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2012 10:54 AM
Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Brahmin bridegrooms not getting brides

On Wed, Jun 27, 2012 at 10:57 PM, Vidyasankar Sundaresan <
svidyasankar-***@public.gmane.org> wrote:

> The varNa of a person has always been a complicated
> matter and there has really never been anybody who could have claimed
> that all his relatives belonged to the same varNa as himself.
>

It is very true.  One can never be sure, maybe beyond three generations
backwards about the varNa of one's ancestors unless family tree records are
maintained. Someone known to me, a brahmin, has a close relative who has
married a non-brahmin girl.  He says: after six years of her living in this
house, she gets the varNa of this family.  I do not know if there is any
scriptural support for this.  In any case, I am also told that some
Peethadhipathis have said that brahmin boys may marry vaishya girls if
there is no other option.  But then what varNa does the offspring get?  I
suppose there are some specific varNa names for the offspring of such
marriages.  I remember to have seen some of these names in the
Br.Up.Bhashya/or gloss.  Someone may pl. show that.

subrahmanian.v


>
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[Abhishek Madhyastha]

Pranams,

I myself have observed one thing as the admin of a page called
"Brahmin Culture and Tradition" which is the largest page consisting
of brahmins on facebook. My sole aim has been to reinstate faith in
the Brahmana dharma. Around 55-60% members are men while women
compromise of 45-50%. Surprisingly, around 65-70% are youth and mostly
from Maharashtra area. Most females have no idea about the shastras
compared to males. Maybe this is because boys get atleast minimal
exposure durin gtheir upanayana. Most females have blind faith in our
culture. They are not total non-believers but the general notion is
they are not ready to believe or live under the bounds of shastras
unless they are convinced as to why. They demand a secure life and
they feel they cannot get it if they marry a vaidhika. I know of a
person back in my native who's father is a vaidhika. He got into
engineering but learnt the vaidhika dharma from his father. To this
day he performs rituals for people free of cost in all his free time!
The bottomline is that brahmins of these times, especially small
children and teenagers have no exposure to the greatness of the
Brahmana dharma and its history. Once the upanayana is done,
finished!! That's the last time the boy will hear any spiritual
aspects in his life, forget about Brahmin dharma. We all expect an
instant solution to this but that's seems impossible unless we see an
avatara of god. The only way from what I'm seeing is that there needs
to be a completely united forum/platform for the entire country
covering all types of Brahmins and under this platform we must bring
faith in Brahmins, especially in the youth of the nation. Why I stress
"youth" is that, even though I'm the admin of such a huge page I'm an
18 year old teenager myself. I myself see many of my Brahmin friends
have little knowledge about our dharma,etc. When I speak to them about
it, they do show interest to learn more. Even the worst of my Brahmin
friends that I've seen(he smokes and drinks) wants to and does
performs sandhyavandana once a day! When I ask him why, he says he has
faith in god and he does these things not by his will but because of
his friends. Absence of satsanga. This is the way Brahmins nowadays
are getting spoilt. As the Bhaja Govindam says- "Satsangatve
nissagatvam".

On 6/27/12, Sunil Bhattacharjya <sunil_bhattacharjya-/***@public.gmane.org> wrote:
> Namaste,
>
>
> In the same vein one may aske what was the Varna of the sage Vedavyasa, who
> had a brahmin father (Parashara) and a Kaivarta mother (Matsyagandha turned
> Satyavati).
>
> Regards,
> Sunil KB
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: V Subrahmanian <v.subrahmanian-***@public.gmane.org>
> To: A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta
> <advaita-l-4gKAAF5ltrLLd2BZh+***@public.gmane.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2012 10:54 AM
> Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Brahmin bridegrooms not getting brides
>
> On Wed, Jun 27, 2012 at 10:57 PM, Vidyasankar Sundaresan <
> svidyasankar-***@public.gmane.org> wrote:
>
>> The varNa of a person has always been a complicated
>> matter and there has really never been anybody who could have claimed
>> that all his relatives belonged to the same varNa as himself.
>>
>
> It is very true.  One can never be sure, maybe beyond three generations
> backwards about the varNa of one's ancestors unless family tree records are
> maintained. Someone known to me, a brahmin, has a close relative who has
> married a non-brahmin girl.  He says: after six years of her living in this
> house, she gets the varNa of this family.  I do not know if there is any
> scriptural support for this.  In any case, I am also told that some
> Peethadhipathis have said that brahmin boys may marry vaishya girls if
> there is no other option.  But then what varNa does the offspring get?  I
> suppose there are some specific varNa names for the offspring of such
> marriages.  I remember to have seen some of these names in the
> Br.Up.Bhashya/or gloss.  Someone may pl. show that.
>
> subrahmanian.v
>
>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Archives: http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/archives/advaita-l/
> http://blog.gmane.org/gmane.culture.religion.advaita
>
> To unsubscribe or change your options:
> http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/cgi-bin/listinfo/advaita-l
>
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> _______________________________________________
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>
> To unsubscribe or change your options:
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>
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>

[Rajaram Venkataramani]

The solution is exceedingly simple. Brahmin boys should be intelligent in
managing finances whether they do vaidhika or secular profession. They
should work out right from school or gurukula days. My karate master
Shihaan Husseini used to say,"My students should be fit and masters in
karate like the priest in ashtalaksmi temple". I strongly recommend the
following for all normal healthy individuals of any age who have doctor's
permission to exercise.

1. https://www.supreme90dayworkout.com/
2. http://www.thehourofpower.co.uk/

The boys should know Kama Shastra before getting married. They should abide
by dharma like Rama. The daughter-in-law should be treated with affection
by the patents-in-law. The girls should in their heart of hearts accept
their in-laws like their own parents.

[Sunil Bhattacharjya]

Dear friends,

Is this a genuine mail from Shri Rajaram or s his id hacked?

Assuming this to be genuine mail I would advise the Brahmin boys to learn Tai Chi rather than Karate. People generally think of Tai Chi more as a delicate dance-form with some health benefits. Nothing can be further from the truth.  Originally Tai Chi can be said to be from Kanchipuram as Bodhi dharma introduced it as a fitness regime in Shaolin and later on a Shaolin master converted it to a training system, where students can be trained in this deadly self-defence system , which uses the power of the opponent against the opponent, while conserving one's own power and yet there is no sign of any combat-training..  Tai Chi thus conforms to the Brahmanical attitude of non-aggression yet providing a deadly defence so that the opponent however powerful would have to eat a humble pie, should he or she dare to attack ones knowing tai Chi. The advanced Tai Chi students, who are older (say 55+ years), only were taught about the 107 +1 vital points in the body
and the use of the required Tai Chi movements to reach those points of the attacker, should one be attacked. These 108 Vital points were taught by Agastya and are also mentioned in the ancient Ayurveda texts. Basically Tai Chi is a non-aggressive style and has tremendous health benefits. Further being a peaceful method it can be practised anywhere. Once a competition was arranged between two Tai Chi masters and the fight never began as none of them would strike first. Such is the peaceful stance of Tai-Chi. I really enjoy Tai Chi even as a senior citizen.


This is not in anyway to denigrate the Karata, King-fu and other martial arts.

Regards,
Sunil KB


________________________________
From: Rajaram Venkataramani <rajaramvenk-***@public.gmane.org>
To: A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta <advaita-l-4gKAAF5ltrLLd2BZh+9d9q/***@public.gmane.org.org>
Cc: Sunil Bhattacharjya <sunil_bhattacharjya-/***@public.gmane.org>
Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2012 1:17 PM
Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Brahmin bridegrooms not getting brides


The solution is exceedingly simple. Brahmin boys should be intelligent in managing finances whether they do vaidhika or secular profession. They should work out right from school or gurukula days. My karate master Shihaan Husseini used to say,"My students should be fit and masters in karate like the priest in ashtalaksmi temple". I strongly recommend the following for all normal healthy individuals of any age who have doctor's permission to exercise. 

1. https://www.supreme90dayworkout.com/
2. http://www.thehourofpower.co.uk/

The boys should know Kama Shastra before getting married. They should abide by dharma like Rama. The daughter-in-law should be treated with affection by the patents-in-law. The girls should in their heart of hearts accept their in-laws like their own parents.

[Abhishek Madhyastha]

If at all martial arts is the requirement of the hour, then why not
learn the oldest of all martial arts- Kalaripayattu? The art form was
introduced to the world by Bhagavan Parasurama and 21 of his best
disciples(all brahmins) were made as the heads of the kalaris he
established. Kalaripayattu is considered the mother of all martial
arts and even Bodhi Dharma was an expert in this art itself. It has
over 3000 years of documented history. Wouldn't it be more suitable to
learn such an art which has its origins fixed to a brahmin?

On 6/28/12, Sunil Bhattacharjya <sunil_bhattacharjya-/***@public.gmane.org> wrote:
> Dear friends,
>
> Is this a genuine mail from Shri Rajaram or s his id hacked?
>
> Assuming this to be genuine mail I would advise the Brahmin boys to learn
> Tai Chi rather than Karate. People generally think of Tai Chi more as a
> delicate dance-form with some health benefits. Nothing can be further from
> the truth.  Originally Tai Chi can be said to be from Kanchipuram as Bodhi
> dharma introduced it as a fitness regime in Shaolin and later on a Shaolin
> master converted it to a training system, where students can be trained in
> this deadly self-defence system , which uses the power of the opponent
> against the opponent, while conserving one's own power and yet there is no
> sign of any combat-training..  Tai Chi thus conforms to the Brahmanical
> attitude of non-aggression yet providing a deadly defence so that the
> opponent however powerful would have to eat a humble pie, should he or she
> dare to attack ones knowing tai Chi. The advanced Tai Chi students, who are
> older (say 55+ years), only were taught about the 107 +1 vital points in the
> body
> and the use of the required Tai Chi movements to reach those points of the
> attacker, should one be attacked. These 108 Vital points were taught by
> Agastya and are also mentioned in the ancient Ayurveda texts. Basically Tai
> Chi is a non-aggressive style and has tremendous health benefits. Further
> being a peaceful method it can be practised anywhere. Once a competition was
> arranged between two Tai Chi masters and the fight never began as none of
> them would strike first. Such is the peaceful stance of Tai-Chi. I really
> enjoy Tai Chi even as a senior citizen.
>
>
> This is not in anyway to denigrate the Karata, King-fu and other martial
> arts.
>
> Regards,
> Sunil KB
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Rajaram Venkataramani <rajaramvenk-***@public.gmane.org>
> To: A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta
> <advaita-l-4gKAAF5ltrLLd2BZh+***@public.gmane.org>
> Cc: Sunil Bhattacharjya <sunil_bhattacharjya-/***@public.gmane.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2012 1:17 PM
> Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Brahmin bridegrooms not getting brides
>
>
> The solution is exceedingly simple. Brahmin boys should be intelligent in
> managing finances whether they do vaidhika or secular profession. They
> should work out right from school or gurukula days. My karate master Shihaan
> Husseini used to say,"My students should be fit and masters in karate like
> the priest in ashtalaksmi temple". I strongly recommend the following for
> all normal healthy individuals of any age who have doctor's permission to
> exercise.
>
> 1. https://www.supreme90dayworkout.com/
> 2. http://www.thehourofpower.co.uk/
>
> The boys should know Kama Shastra before getting married. They should abide
> by dharma like Rama. The daughter-in-law should be treated with affection by
> the patents-in-law. The girls should in their heart of hearts accept their
> in-laws like their own parents.
> _______________________________________________
> Archives: http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/archives/advaita-l/
> http://blog.gmane.org/gmane.culture.religion.advaita
>
> To unsubscribe or change your options:
> http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/cgi-bin/listinfo/advaita-l
>
> For assistance, contact:
> listmaster-wFjFOH+xtB+LP2KLBgAKiEB+***@public.gmane.org
>

[vijayalakshmi ravindran]

Dear Friends ,

This problem is there in all subjects of Brahmins,Infact Madhwa Swamijis
are openly reaching out the public ,appealing for the girls to get married
to Pandits . Such a sorry state of affairs

As I see the thread is commented by men,its one pointed view.Why women are
not interested in getting into Vedic dharma or Vaidika dharma?
Have you are really pondered on this issue .? Seriously NO.

See all the Mutts , they have gurukulams all over the country only for boys
!!!!Do you find any for girls? I haven't seen any.Esteemed members
please enlighten me if you have seen any .Only one in Pune where they teach
women to do Satyanarayan puja ,Marriage and other functions I have read
about this in The Hindu long ago .why not have such institutions all over
the country?

Yes I understand girls have issues of reaching puberty and become mature
and so the Vedic Dharma says women have to be at home.
Home is where they have to learn. But think and ponder from the age of 5 to
10 can't they be too trained in Vedic dharmic way of life .

Most of the homes do not follow the same pattern of dharmas laid down by
the Shastras too,each household has a different set of rules of rajaswala ,
and other practices . Just like men have a single Sandhyavanadana procedure
according to his Mutt or guru parampara, why not have
a single set of rules to the women folk too , teach the girls young at
least in the summer camps to be arranged by the various mutt branches and
see the difference at least the coming generations will not have to face
this problems.

And the issue of giving importance to the male child, this has taken such a
worse turn that we see the ratios of male : female going so down.Who is the
cause behind this ? PONDER please .I want a male child to continue my
family should stop .Only then there will be more girls in the brahmin
community .

Make a course of study for them too ,just like Pandits ,so that at least
they do will learn the traditional way the brahminic culture .

Also ,each subsect , or followers of each guru want girls in their own sub
sect language and so on , this also is limiting the choice of the brahmins
to intermarry within the sects, e.g.:This inter marriages between smarthas
and madhwas, vice versa , was going on till recently,now they differences
are so pronounced that they are not willing to take or give girls to other
brahmin sects

Any in most of the cases its the father of the girl who is not interested
in getting his daughter married to the Vedic Brahmana too.

Just blaming the women folk saying they are becoming modern than men is
wrong too.Infact in many homes as wornen we see traditions are kept alive
by the women folk .Even after going to work raising their children,taking
care of their elders and men : many a women are still do their household
pujas like Varalakshmi vratam and Krishna jay anti etc with so much bhakti
and devotion .

I am a lay person in the matters of Dharma and Shastra , but a women,s
point of view is also needed here .

Namaskaarams
Mrs Vijayalakshmi Ravindran


On Thu, Jun 28, 2012 at 3:04 AM, Sunil Bhattacharjya <
sunil_bhattacharjya-/***@public.gmane.org> wrote:

> [image: Boxbe] <https://www.boxbe.com/overview> This message is eligible
> for Automatic Cleanup! (sunil_bhattacharjya-/***@public.gmane.org) Add cleanup rule<https://www.boxbe.com/popup?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.boxbe.com%2Fcleanup%3Ftoken%3D%252BlyBPBon6O7DJtw3ROtoPyeTfaf%252FzAAz%252B1bTr2e0VVcvp6sAF5GxlhgwnxccobYhudIKkkOumUciCLuAJ27Oj%252BubryxZAwtkt9ksFIZ9ttidEdBJZQJr35Sf%252BS08ELpJ7tQiCKa%252FVUSZUanhnD2qEBUIHbWIX0I8%26key%3DzoMoTVrZSMrf35GGqGn3pL6gFfvO2R7cYkVMHfgR9Zs%253D&tc=11698090795_828146261>| More
> info<http://blog.boxbe.com/general/boxbe-automatic-cleanup?tc=11698090795_828146261>
>
> Dear friends,
>
> Is this a genuine mail from Shri Rajaram or s his id hacked?
>
> Assuming this to be genuine mail I would advise the Brahmin boys to learn
> Tai Chi rather than Karate. People generally think of Tai Chi more as a
> delicate dance-form with some health benefits. Nothing can be further from
> the truth. Originally Tai Chi can be said to be from Kanchipuram as Bodhi
> dharma introduced it as a fitness regime in Shaolin and later on a Shaolin
> master converted it to a training system, where students can be trained in
> this deadly self-defence system , which uses the power of the opponent
> against the opponent, while conserving one's own power and yet there is no
> sign of any combat-training.. Tai Chi thus conforms to the Brahmanical
> attitude of non-aggression yet providing a deadly defence so that the
> opponent however powerful would have to eat a humble pie, should he or she
> dare to attack ones knowing tai Chi. The advanced Tai Chi students, who are
> older (say 55+ years), only were taught about the 107 +1 vital points in
> the body
> and the use of the required Tai Chi movements to reach those points of
> the attacker, should one be attacked. These 108 Vital points were taught by
> Agastya and are also mentioned in the ancient Ayurveda texts. Basically Tai
> Chi is a non-aggressive style and has tremendous health benefits. Further
> being a peaceful method it can be practised anywhere. Once a competition
> was arranged between two Tai Chi masters and the fight never began as none
> of them would strike first. Such is the peaceful stance of Tai-Chi. I
> really enjoy Tai Chi even as a senior citizen.
>
>
> This is not in anyway to denigrate the Karata, King-fu and other martial
> arts.
>
> Regards,
> Sunil KB
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Rajaram Venkataramani <rajaramvenk-***@public.gmane.org>
> To: A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta <
> advaita-l-4gKAAF5ltrLLd2BZh+***@public.gmane.org>
> Cc: Sunil Bhattacharjya <sunil_bhattacharjya-/***@public.gmane.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2012 1:17 PM
> Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Brahmin bridegrooms not getting brides
>
>
> The solution is exceedingly simple. Brahmin boys should be intelligent in
> managing finances whether they do vaidhika or secular profession. They
> should work out right from school or gurukula days. My karate master
> Shihaan Husseini used to say,"My students should be fit and masters in
> karate like the priest in ashtalaksmi temple". I strongly recommend the
> following for all normal healthy individuals of any age who have doctor's
> permission to exercise.
>
> 1. https://www.supreme90dayworkout.com/
> 2. http://www.thehourofpower.co.uk/
>
> The boys should know Kama Shastra before getting married. They should
> abide by dharma like Rama. The daughter-in-law should be treated with
> affection by the patents-in-law. The girls should in their heart of hearts
> accept their in-laws like their own parents.
> _______________________________________________
> Archives: http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/archives/advaita-l/
> http://blog.gmane.org/gmane.culture.religion.advaita
>
> To unsubscribe or change your options:
> http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/cgi-bin/listinfo/advaita-l
>
> For assistance, contact:
> listmaster-wFjFOH+xtB+LP2KLBgAKiEB+***@public.gmane.org
>
>

[Vidyasankar Sundaresan]

Finally. It is good to see a lady's voice on these sorts of questions on this list.

You bring up a number of good points. Neglecting the education of the
girl child has had disastrous consequences for us. However, I would add
the caveat that teaching vaidika dharma to someone does not necessarily
mean teaching that person to chant portions of the veda and get trained
to be a purohita. For a purohita to be active presumes a yajamAna and
in the vaidika ritual tradition, a yajamAna almost always presumes a
yajamAnI. We need to teach our young ones how to be yajamAnas and
yajamAnIs first. It is like teaching students how to listen to music or to
appreciate painting. They do not have to become professional musicians
or artists themselves.


>
> And the issue of giving importance to the male child, this has taken such a
> worse turn that we see the ratios of male : female going so down.Who is the
> cause behind this ? PONDER please .I want a male child to continue my
> family should stop .Only then there will be more girls in the brahmin
> community .
>

On this count, I am unaware if there has been any study that analyzes male
to female ratio by caste. My gut feeling is that in brAhmaNa communities, the
problem is not one of numbers. It is one of not conveying dharma properly to
children, both boys and girls.

> Just blaming the women folk saying they are becoming modern than men is
> wrong too.Infact in many homes as wornen we see traditions are kept alive
> by the women folk .Even after going to work raising their children,taking
> care of their elders and men : many a women are still do their household
> pujas like Varalakshmi vratam and Krishna jay anti etc with so much bhakti
> and devotion .

Yes, that is indeed true. That is why I said earlier that the blame lies largely
with us men.

Best regards,
Vidyasankar

[sriram]

Dear
The reluctance of father/mother /both to marry off their daughter to a
vaidhika brahmana also contributes to this state of affairs.Here the
parents think that the status of a vaidhika brahmana is lower in society not
due to absence of wealth but it is perceived to be lower for declaring in
society that their son -in-law is a vaidhika brahmana.Iam no exception.
So also a businessman as a son -in-law is only a second or third
choice.Parents want their daughters to be well above wants and also society
accepted status levels.May be there is no logical reason but it is
there.Like preference for a fair skinned girl to a swarthy.These are all
unexplained but these prejudices do exist.Only education by our Upanyasa
Karthas -like our Velukudi Krishnan Swamigal -will remove this type of
prejudices.R.Krishnamoorthy.
----- Original Message -----
From: "vijayalakshmi ravindran" <mamam4-***@public.gmane.org>
To: "Sunil Bhattacharjya" <sunil_bhattacharjya-/***@public.gmane.org>; "A discussion
group for Advaita Vedanta" <advaita-l-4gKAAF5ltrLLd2BZh+***@public.gmane.org>
Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2012 9:21 AM
Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Brahmin bridegrooms not getting brides *


> Dear Friends ,
>
> This problem is there in all subjects of Brahmins,Infact Madhwa Swamijis
> are openly reaching out the public ,appealing for the girls to get married
> to Pandits . Such a sorry state of affairs
>
> As I see the thread is commented by men,its one pointed view.Why women are
> not interested in getting into Vedic dharma or Vaidika dharma?
> Have you are really pondered on this issue .? Seriously NO.
>
> See all the Mutts , they have gurukulams all over the country only for
> boys
> !!!!Do you find any for girls? I haven't seen any.Esteemed members
> please enlighten me if you have seen any .Only one in Pune where they
> teach
> women to do Satyanarayan puja ,Marriage and other functions I have read
> about this in The Hindu long ago .why not have such institutions all over
> the country?
>
> Yes I understand girls have issues of reaching puberty and become mature
> and so the Vedic Dharma says women have to be at home.
> Home is where they have to learn. But think and ponder from the age of 5
> to
> 10 can't they be too trained in Vedic dharmic way of life .
>
> Most of the homes do not follow the same pattern of dharmas laid down by
> the Shastras too,each household has a different set of rules of rajaswala
> ,
> and other practices . Just like men have a single Sandhyavanadana
> procedure
> according to his Mutt or guru parampara, why not have
> a single set of rules to the women folk too , teach the girls young at
> least in the summer camps to be arranged by the various mutt branches and
> see the difference at least the coming generations will not have to face
> this problems.
>
> And the issue of giving importance to the male child, this has taken such
> a
> worse turn that we see the ratios of male : female going so down.Who is
> the
> cause behind this ? PONDER please .I want a male child to continue my
> family should stop .Only then there will be more girls in the brahmin
> community .
>
> Make a course of study for them too ,just like Pandits ,so that at least
> they do will learn the traditional way the brahminic culture .
>
> Also ,each subsect , or followers of each guru want girls in their own sub
> sect language and so on , this also is limiting the choice of the brahmins
> to intermarry within the sects, e.g.:This inter marriages between smarthas
> and madhwas, vice versa , was going on till recently,now they differences
> are so pronounced that they are not willing to take or give girls to other
> brahmin sects
>
> Any in most of the cases its the father of the girl who is not interested
> in getting his daughter married to the Vedic Brahmana too.
>
> Just blaming the women folk saying they are becoming modern than men is
> wrong too.Infact in many homes as wornen we see traditions are kept alive
> by the women folk .Even after going to work raising their children,taking
> care of their elders and men : many a women are still do their household
> pujas like Varalakshmi vratam and Krishna jay anti etc with so much bhakti
> and devotion .
>
> I am a lay person in the matters of Dharma and Shastra , but a women,s
> point of view is also needed here .
>
> Namaskaarams
> Mrs Vijayalakshmi Ravindran
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 28, 2012 at 3:04 AM, Sunil Bhattacharjya <
> sunil_bhattacharjya-/***@public.gmane.org> wrote:
>
>> [image: Boxbe] <https://www.boxbe.com/overview> This message is eligible
>> for Automatic Cleanup! (sunil_bhattacharjya-/***@public.gmane.org) Add cleanup
>> rule<https://www.boxbe.com/popup?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.boxbe.com%2Fcleanup%3Ftoken%3D%252BlyBPBon6O7DJtw3ROtoPyeTfaf%252FzAAz%252B1bTr2e0VVcvp6sAF5GxlhgwnxccobYhudIKkkOumUciCLuAJ27Oj%252BubryxZAwtkt9ksFIZ9ttidEdBJZQJr35Sf%252BS08ELpJ7tQiCKa%252FVUSZUanhnD2qEBUIHbWIX0I8%26key%3DzoMoTVrZSMrf35GGqGn3pL6gFfvO2R7cYkVMHfgR9Zs%253D&tc=11698090795_828146261>|
>> More
>> info<http://blog.boxbe.com/general/boxbe-automatic-cleanup?tc=11698090795_828146261>
>>
>> Dear friends,
>>
>> Is this a genuine mail from Shri Rajaram or s his id hacked?
>>
>> Assuming this to be genuine mail I would advise the Brahmin boys to learn
>> Tai Chi rather than Karate. People generally think of Tai Chi more as a
>> delicate dance-form with some health benefits. Nothing can be further
>> from
>> the truth. Originally Tai Chi can be said to be from Kanchipuram as
>> Bodhi
>> dharma introduced it as a fitness regime in Shaolin and later on a
>> Shaolin
>> master converted it to a training system, where students can be trained
>> in
>> this deadly self-defence system , which uses the power of the opponent
>> against the opponent, while conserving one's own power and yet there is
>> no
>> sign of any combat-training.. Tai Chi thus conforms to the Brahmanical
>> attitude of non-aggression yet providing a deadly defence so that the
>> opponent however powerful would have to eat a humble pie, should he or
>> she
>> dare to attack ones knowing tai Chi. The advanced Tai Chi students, who
>> are
>> older (say 55+ years), only were taught about the 107 +1 vital points in
>> the body
>> and the use of the required Tai Chi movements to reach those points of
>> the attacker, should one be attacked. These 108 Vital points were taught
>> by
>> Agastya and are also mentioned in the ancient Ayurveda texts. Basically
>> Tai
>> Chi is a non-aggressive style and has tremendous health benefits. Further
>> being a peaceful method it can be practised anywhere. Once a competition
>> was arranged between two Tai Chi masters and the fight never began as
>> none
>> of them would strike first. Such is the peaceful stance of Tai-Chi. I
>> really enjoy Tai Chi even as a senior citizen.
>>
>>
>> This is not in anyway to denigrate the Karata, King-fu and other martial
>> arts.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Sunil KB
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
>> From: Rajaram Venkataramani <rajaramvenk-***@public.gmane.org>
>> To: A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta <
>> advaita-l-4gKAAF5ltrLLd2BZh+***@public.gmane.org>
>> Cc: Sunil Bhattacharjya <sunil_bhattacharjya-/***@public.gmane.org>
>> Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2012 1:17 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Brahmin bridegrooms not getting brides
>>
>>
>> The solution is exceedingly simple. Brahmin boys should be intelligent in
>> managing finances whether they do vaidhika or secular profession. They
>> should work out right from school or gurukula days. My karate master
>> Shihaan Husseini used to say,"My students should be fit and masters in
>> karate like the priest in ashtalaksmi temple". I strongly recommend the
>> following for all normal healthy individuals of any age who have doctor's
>> permission to exercise.
>>
>> 1. https://www.supreme90dayworkout.com/
>> 2. http://www.thehourofpower.co.uk/
>>
>> The boys should know Kama Shastra before getting married. They should
>> abide by dharma like Rama. The daughter-in-law should be treated with
>> affection by the patents-in-law. The girls should in their heart of
>> hearts
>> accept their in-laws like their own parents.
>> _______________________________________________
>> Archives: http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/archives/advaita-l/
>> http://blog.gmane.org/gmane.culture.religion.advaita
>>
>> To unsubscribe or change your options:
>> http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/cgi-bin/listinfo/advaita-l
>>
>> For assistance, contact:
>> listmaster-wFjFOH+xtB+LP2KLBgAKiEB+***@public.gmane.org
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Archives: http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/archives/advaita-l/
> http://blog.gmane.org/gmane.culture.religion.advaita
>
> To unsubscribe or change your options:
> http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/cgi-bin/listinfo/advaita-l
>
> For assistance, contact:
> listmaster-wFjFOH+xtB+LP2KLBgAKiEB+***@public.gmane.org

[Sunil Bhattacharjya]

Namaste,

I think that in this age of Internet debates the Sringeri math should make the books like "Parashara Madhaviya" and "Jivanmukti Viveka"  in the original Sanskrit texts, available in the pdf versions (as no copyright can be claimed for these texts composed centuries ago). One can however claim copyrights for the translations one makes. Parashara had relaxed many rules. For example the Sati is not advisable in the Kali yuga and widow marriage is also not a taboo any more.

Regards,
Sunil KB





________________________________
From: Vidyasankar Sundaresan <svidyasankar-***@public.gmane.org>
To: Advaita List <advaita-l-4gKAAF5ltrLLd2BZh+***@public.gmane.org>
Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2012 10:27 AM
Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Brahmin bridegrooms not getting brides


>
> This is all happening because the Brahmin women are becoming more and
> more modern looking and thinking like Westerners. If this situation
> continues the Vaidika Brahmin tradition will become very weak and die.

While on this subject, let us be very honest and acknowledge that a lot of
this situation is self-made by brAhmaNa communities all over. Traditional
conceptions of strIdharma vary a lot from region to region, but over the
last century, no effort has been made to educate boys and girls about the
requirements of dharma. When brAhmaNa men who are supposed to be
exemplars of certain qualities have, by and large, abandoned their own
heritage for other pursuits, and do not even do the basic minimum, how
fair is it to expect that only their women should follow all the rules in strict
conformity? Swami Vivekananda made the observation that we relegate
our dharma to the kitchen. More than a hundred years later, women do
not want to be relegated to the kitchen either, so if anybody is to share
the major portion of the blame, it is the category of brAhmaNa males,
nobody else.

> One Badaganadu Brahmin named Vasudeva Murthy told me Sringeri Swami
> Sri Bharati Teertha has given advice to Brahmin boys to marry
> vegetarian brides from other castes if they don't get Brahmins. Is
> this a correct approach? What is the Dharma Sastra support for this
> approach? Kindly explain.

Well, one can sit around wringing one's hands and bemoaning the fall of
brAhmaNa dharma, or one can make use the dharmaSAstra rule that allows
marriages between brAhmaNa men and women of any caste. It is called
anuloma vivAha, while the marriage of a brAhmaNa born woman with a
man of another caste is called pratiloma. There are lots of instances going
back all the way to the very beginning of the brAhmaNa gotras - jamadagni's
wife, the mother of paraSurAma, was a kshatriya girl. sukanyA, who married
cyavana, was also the daughter of a king. Every brAhmaNa today who belongs
to a gotra beginning with bhRgu in the pravara has had a kshatriya female
ancestor in the remote past. satyavatI, the mother of veda vyAsa, was a
fisherman's daughter, while dhRtarAshTra and pANDu, biological sons of
vyAsa, were kshatriya and vidura, another biological son of vyAsa, was
considered SUdra. The varNa of a person has always been a complicated
matter and there has really never ben anybody who could have claimed
that all his relatives belonged to the same varNa as himself.

In one of the 8 recognized forms of marriage, a yajamAna could offer a
daughter in marriage to the purohita, as part of the dakshiNA for the ritual.
There is no specification in the dharmaSAstra-s that such a yajamAna also
had to be a brAhmaNa. In the upanishad that teaches the samvarga vidyA,
jAnaSruti pautrAyana gave his daughter to raikva. jAnaSruti was a kshatriya
too. raikva called him a SUdra, but did not reject his offer of a daughter in
marriage. There is one well known instance of pratiloma marriage in the
epics - yayAti, a king, married devayAnI, the daughter of Sukra, and they
were the ancestors of almost everybody in the mahAbhArata, including the
pANdava-s, the dhArtarAshTra-s, karNa, bhIshma and kRshNa too.

All this shows that there is a long dhArmika history behind what the Sringeri
Acharya has suggested. Having said this, let me say something else. Asking
the question, "is this a correct approach?" is superfluous and the paragraphs
I've written above are totally unnecessary. If Sringeri Acharya recommends
a course of action, you can rest assured that it is in accordance with dharma,
by default. There is no need to second guess it and seek further justification.
I have only offered the above details for the sake of the general discussion.
At a personal level, if one has a question about dharma and one approaches
a guru for advice, then one needs to have the requisite SraddhA in the guru
and the advice that he gives. The words of a Sankaracharya are not things
in the market place to be bought, tested and returned or thrown away if one
doesn't like them.

In Tamil, we say, this is not "kattarikkai vyApAram".

As a practical matter for today, let me just add this. I sincerely hope that a
brahmAna boy who is observant about his duties and the girl he marries from
another community really work at keeping their marriage intact and make it
work through the long years they have to live together, rather than resort to
the easy legal option of divorce that is used willy-nilly nowadays, when the
going gets tough, as it invariably will, at one time or the other.

Regards,
Vidyasankar
                                         
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[Venkatesh Murthy]

Namaste

On Wed, Jun 27, 2012 at 10:57 PM, Vidyasankar Sundaresan
<svidyasankar-***@public.gmane.org> wrote:
> Well, one can sit around wringing one's hands and bemoaning the fall of
> brAhmaNa dharma, or one can make use the dharmaSAstra rule that allows
> marriages between brAhmaNa men and women of any caste. It is called
> anuloma vivAha,

Sri Ravi Chandrasekhara has written in another thread-
>8.I also read on a Madhva site, that if one parent is a Dvija, and another a Shudra; then the sons have no adhikara for Upanayana.

There must be some justification for the Madhva rule also. Your
examples are not from Kali Yuga at all but from others. There must be
some Dharma Sastra behind the Madhva rule. We have to find out. If the
Madhva rule is also correct the Anuloma rule is to marry a non Brahmin
girl but from Kshatriya or Vaisya caste only but not Sudras and SC/ST.
But nowadays there are not many pure Kshatriyas. I heard they also
married many other caste girls. They have lost the true Kshatriyatva.
Vaisyas are also not interested in making marriage alliances with
Brahmins. They also have married from other castes.

In Karnataka the Lingayat and Vokkaliga communites are the largest.
This will leave a large Sudra population as the only choice for
getting girls for our Vaidika Brahmins. If they marry girls from Sudra
caste they are doomed because the children will not be eligible for
Upanayana and Veda Adhyayana. A Brahmin marrying the Sudra girl may
lose his Brahmantva itself.

> All this shows that there is a long dhArmika history behind what the Sringeri
> Acharya has suggested. Having said this, let me say something else. Asking
> the question, "is this a correct approach?" is superfluous and the paragraphs
> I've written above are totally unnecessary. If Sringeri Acharya recommends
> a course of action, you can rest assured that it is in accordance with dharma,
> by default. There is no need to second guess it and seek further justification.
> I have only offered the above details for the sake of the general discussion.
> At a personal level, if one has a question about dharma and one approaches
> a guru for advice, then one needs to have the requisite SraddhA in the guru
> and the advice that he gives. The words of a Sankaracharya are not things
> in the market place to be bought, tested and returned or thrown away if one
> doesn't like them.
>
We have to find out what Sringeri Acharya said exactly. If he said you
can marry vegetarian girls from any caste including Sudras it is a
problem. If he said marry from Kshatriya and Vaisya castes there may
still be a problem.

> Regards,
> Vidyasankar
>


--
Regards

-Venkatesh

[Vidyasankar Sundaresan]

> > All this shows that there is a long dhArmika history behind what the Sringeri
> > Acharya has suggested. Having said this, let me say something else. Asking
> > the question, "is this a correct approach?" is superfluous and the paragraphs
> > I've written above are totally unnecessary. If Sringeri Acharya recommends
> > a course of action, you can rest assured that it is in accordance with dharma,
... ... ...
> >
> We have to find out what Sringeri Acharya said exactly. If he said you
> can marry vegetarian girls from any caste including Sudras it is a
> problem. If he said marry from Kshatriya and Vaisya castes there may
> still be a problem.
>

Firstly, you refuse to get my point about SraddhA that what the Sringeri
Acharya recommends will always be in accordance with dharma. Do you
think he holds custody of a Peetham with a hoary history and tradition,
without the knowledge of dharma that will have taken all your above
questions into account already?

If you want to keep finding problems with the advice given by the Sringeri
Acharya, then please, by all means, do not go to him for guidance and if
you have not gone to him directly, please do not cite what he supposedly
said to somebody at some time. There are hundreds of other Acharyas
whom you could contact for these issues. If you are interested in finding
out what exactly the Sringeri Acharya said, you should contact somebody
officially from the Sringeri Peetham or better still, simply go and ask the
Swamiji in person yourself. Thousands of people see him every day and
ask similar questions. This forum is hardly the place to speculate.

On the flip side, almost every one among the thousands who go to him
is only interested in what to eat and whom to sleep with. Nobody seems
to want to seriously pursue any vedAnta vicAra and seek advice on what
they need to do to gain the necessary qualifications for it. And this forum,
meant for advaita vedAnta discussion, shares the same fate. Can we put
these topics to rest soon?

Vidyasankar

[Sankaran Aniruddhan]

namastE,

> What is the Dharma Sastra support for this approach?

baudhAyana dharmasUtra 1.8:


चत्वारो वर्णा ब्राह्मण -क्षत्रिय -विट् -शूद्राः ॥तेषां वर्ण -अनुपूर्व्येण चतस्रो भार्या ब्राह्मणस्य ॥तिस्रो राजन्यस्य ॥
द्वे वैश्यस्य ॥
एका शूद्रस्य ॥
तासु पुत्राः सवर्ण -अनन्तरासु सवर्णाः ॥
एकान्तर -द्व्यन्तरास्वम्बष्ठ -उग्र -निषादाः ॥
प्रतिलोमास्वायोगव -मागध -वैण -क्षत्तृ -पुल्कस -कुक्कुट -वैदेहक -चण्डालः ॥

A rough translation:
The four varnas are brAhmaNa, kSatriya, vaizya and zudra.A brAhmaNa can have a wife from all four varnas, a kSatriya - a wife from three varnas etc
The children from the wife of the same varna and the adjoining varna have the same varna as the father. (e.g. the child born to a brAhmaNa man and kSatriya woman is a brAhmaNa)

...

The full sanskrit text of the baudhAyana dharmasUtra is available here:
http://sanskrit1.ccv.brown.edu/tomcat/sl/TextViewerEx?format=0&name=baudhdhs&title=The+Baudhayana-Dharmas%C5%ABtra&texttype=all%2Fall%2Fall%2F


Aniruddhan

Sruti smRti purANAnAm Alayam karuNAlayam
namAmi bhagavatpAda Sam.karam lokaSam.karam
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[Venkata sriram P]

Respected Lakshmi Ji,
 
My prostrations to your feet.
 
//
 
Why women are not interested in getting into Vedic dharma or Vaidika dharma?
Have you are really pondered on this issue .? Seriously NO.
 
//
 
Infact, the problem is not with young generation.  The parents should educate them.
Unfortunately, parents themselves are not aware of our dharma shastrAs.
 
Women are always considered to be a part & parcel of our vaidika dharma.  Which is
why they are called *saha-dharma-chAriNi*.  At the time of marriage itself,
women are initiated into *gauri panchAkSari mahAmantra* at the time of gauri pUja
which is performed prior to muhurta. 
 
Now, as regards the vedic rights to women, i request you to read the book "Hindu Dharma"
by Kanchi Mahaperiyaval Shri Chandrasekhara Saraswati Swamigal.  A complete chapter
has been dealt with the rights of women right from aupAsana etc.  
 
//
Only one in Pune where they teach women to do Satyanarayan puja ,Marriage and other functions I have read about this in The Hindu long ago .why not have such institutions all over the country?
//
 
If you know the reason for restricting women from chanting vedas, you too will appreciate
it which is for their welfare only.  The wrong intonation / chanting of vedas will have adverse
effect.  And woman's body being very delicate, especially the internal organs, they are
not allowed to chant vedic mantras, which would have adverse effect on their health.
 
//
Home is where they have to learn. But think and ponder from the age of 5 to
10 can't they be too trained in Vedic dharmic way of life
 
//
 
Yes why not.  Let the parents of the girl take up the responsibility instead
of watching TV serials, cinemas alongwith their children. 
 
//
why not have a single set of rules to the women folk too , teach the girls young at
least in the summer camps to be arranged by the various mutt branches and
see the difference at least the coming generations will not have to face
this problems.
 
//
 
Chinmaya Mission, Ramakrishna Mission & Arsha Vidya Kendras are doing
yeoman service to youngsters with programs like *Bala Vikas* etc.  Let the
sampradAyavAdis appreciate this noble gesture rather than slinging mud
on them.
 
//
And the issue of giving importance to the male child, this has taken such a
worse turn that we see the ratios of male : female going so down.Who is the
cause behind this
//
 
This is a social problem which needs to be tackled at social level like awareness etc.
 
//
Also ,each subsect , or followers of each guru want girls in their own sub
sect language and so on , this also is limiting the choice of the brahmins
to intermarry within the sects, e.g.:This inter marriages between smarthas
and madhwas, vice versa , was going on till recently,now they differences
are so pronounced that they are not willing to take or give girls to other
brahmin sects

//
 
Kanchi Mahaperiyaval addressed this issue long back and approved this.
 
The only issue here is *vEda shAkha*.  Suppose i am a krishna yajurvEdi. 
The problem comes when i marry a girl whose parents are rg vedis.
 
The kanyAdAna, shODasa saMskArAs, sandhyAvandana are different
which vary from veda shAkha to shAkha.
 
//
Infact in many homes as wornen we see traditions are kept alive
by the women folk .Even after going to work raising their children,taking
care of their elders and men : many a women are still do their household
pujas like Varalakshmi vratam and Krishna jay anti etc with so much bhakti
and devotion
 
//
 
Very much true.  Even i too give 100% marks to my beloved wife:))
 
//
I am a lay person in the matters of Dharma and Shastra , but a women,s
point of view is also needed here
 
//
 
Yes.  vidyAH samastAH tava dEvi bhEdAH / striyaH samastAH sakalA jagatsu..says
Devi Mahatmyam.  All the women are the reflections of Divine Mother. 
 
regs,
sriram
 
 
 
 
 

[Abhishek Madhyastha]

I studied in a school in bangalore run by the Sringeri Sharada
Peetham. Its a CBSE school affiliated to Delhi. It has I guess almost
every modern facility you may think of and frankly much more than most
so called international schools. But facilities are not what I'm
interested in or talking about. The unique feature is that, we used to
recite a general prayer, some 20-30 verses of the Bhagawadgita and 1
shloka(usually composed by Bhagavatpada) each and every day for TWELVE
years, i.e right from lkg. There are no caste distinctions but its a
purely hindu school. Its an absolute brahmin oriented school. I used
to see all my fellow male brahmin classmates wear bhasma, mudre,
tirunama,etc. Girls must compulsorily keep a bindhi and wear
bangles,etc. In convents, students and even teachers would ridicule
this. Here, no one from other castes had the guts to ridicule us
because the management was more or less fully comprised of brahmins
from all 3 vargas. Right from small age children are taught ramayana,
mahabharata,etc instead of giving more emphasis on cindrella,etc. If I
remember right, in 6th standard we even had the kathopanishad, of
couse in a simplified form. The point to note is that these were part
of our curriculum itself! No separate hours were allocated for these.
If more and more schools like these came up in the cities, maybe it
would aid in the sustainance of brahmin culture.

[Sunil Bhattacharjya]

May I remind my friends that there is no question for adhikara in case of Bhagavad Gita.
Vedavyasa incorporated it in the Mahabharata for all.

Regards,
Sunil KB



________________________________
From: Abhishek Madhyastha <abhishek046-***@public.gmane.org>
To: A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta <advaita-l-4gKAAF5ltrLLd2BZh+***@public.gmane.org>
Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2012 6:46 AM
Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Brahmin bridegrooms not getting brides *

I studied in a school in bangalore run by the Sringeri Sharada
Peetham. Its a CBSE school affiliated to Delhi. It has I guess almost
every modern facility you may think of and frankly much more than most
so called international schools. But facilities are not what I'm
interested in or talking about. The unique feature is that, we used to
recite a general prayer, some 20-30 verses of the Bhagawadgita and 1
shloka(usually composed by Bhagavatpada) each and every day for TWELVE
years, i.e right from lkg. There are no caste distinctions but its a
purely hindu school. Its an absolute brahmin oriented school. I used
to see all my fellow male brahmin classmates wear bhasma, mudre,
tirunama,etc. Girls must compulsorily keep a bindhi and wear
bangles,etc. In convents, students and even teachers would ridicule
this. Here, no one from other castes had the guts to ridicule us
because the management was more or less fully comprised of brahmins
from all 3 vargas. Right from small age children are taught ramayana,
mahabharata,etc instead of giving more emphasis on cindrella,etc. If I
remember right, in 6th standard we even had the kathopanishad, of
couse in a simplified form. The point to note is that these were part
of our curriculum itself! No separate hours were allocated for these.
If more and more schools like these came up in the cities, maybe it
would aid in the sustainance of brahmin culture.
_______________________________________________
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[Bhaskar YR]

I studied in a school in bangalore run by the Sringeri Sharada
Peetham. Its a CBSE school affiliated to Delhi.

praNAms
Hare Krishna

What is the name of the school & address ?? pls. let me know off the line.

Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!
bhaskar

[Venkatesh Murthy]

Namaste Sri Bhaskar

I think you must always use Information Technology in this day and
age. I cannot live without Google search. I depend on it very much in
my daily life. You can also find all information by Google. Some
people say Google is God. He knows everything. If your Admin is
preventing Google search it is too bad. He must be like a Rakshasa
because he is preventing God into your life. You have to ask God.

Sringeri School is Jnanodaya School in Sankara Pura. Address-

Bull-temple road, Shankara Park,
Shankarapuram, Bangalore - 560004

On Fri, Jun 29, 2012 at 9:00 AM, Bhaskar YR <bhaskar.yr-zOhu8KlzJ1LQT0dZR+***@public.gmane.org> wrote:
> I studied in a school in bangalore run by the Sringeri Sharada
> Peetham. Its a CBSE school affiliated to Delhi.
>
> praNAms
> Hare Krishna
>
> What is the name of the school & address ?? pls. let me know off the line.
>
> Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!
> bhaskar
> _______________________________________________
> Archives: http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/archives/advaita-l/
> http://blog.gmane.org/gmane.culture.religion.advaita
>
> To unsubscribe or change your options:
> http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/cgi-bin/listinfo/advaita-l
>
> For assistance, contact:
> listmaster-wFjFOH+xtB+LP2KLBgAKiEB+***@public.gmane.org



--
Regards

-Venkatesh

[V Subrahmanian]

There is another school under Sringeri Peetham Management, on the
Shankara Mutt Road itself, close to the North Road - The Women's
Peace League School. I am not very sure if this school admits boys.

subrahmanian.v

On 6/29/12, Venkatesh Murthy <vmurthy36-***@public.gmane.org> wrote:
> Namaste Sri Bhaskar
>
> I think you must always use Information Technology in this day and
> age. I cannot live without Google search. I depend on it very much in
> my daily life. You can also find all information by Google. Some
> people say Google is God. He knows everything. If your Admin is
> preventing Google search it is too bad. He must be like a Rakshasa
> because he is preventing God into your life. You have to ask God.
>
> Sringeri School is Jnanodaya School in Sankara Pura. Address-
>
> Bull-temple road, Shankara Park,
> Shankarapuram, Bangalore - 560004
>
> On Fri, Jun 29, 2012 at 9:00 AM, Bhaskar YR <bhaskar.yr-zOhu8KlzJ1LQT0dZR+***@public.gmane.org> wrote:
>> I studied in a school in bangalore run by the Sringeri Sharada
>> Peetham. Its a CBSE school affiliated to Delhi.
>>
>> praNAms
>> Hare Krishna
>>
>> What is the name of the school & address ?? pls. let me know off the
>> line.
>>
>> Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!
>> bhaskar
>> _______________________________________________
>> Archives: http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/archives/advaita-l/
>> http://blog.gmane.org/gmane.culture.religion.advaita
>>
>> To unsubscribe or change your options:
>> http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/cgi-bin/listinfo/advaita-l
>>
>> For assistance, contact:
>> listmaster-wFjFOH+xtB+LP2KLBgAKiEB+***@public.gmane.org
>
>
>
> --
> Regards
>
> -Venkatesh
> _______________________________________________
> Archives: http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/archives/advaita-l/
> http://blog.gmane.org/gmane.culture.religion.advaita
>
> To unsubscribe or change your options:
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>
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>

[Abhishek Madhyastha]

Jnanodaya School
(Run by the Sringeri Sharada Peetham),
Bull temple road, Shankara Park,
Shankarpuram, B'lore-18

To get a complete picture of the school just open the link below.

http://www.sringeri.net/activities/education/jnanodaya-school

On 6/29/12, V Subrahmanian <v.subrahmanian-***@public.gmane.org> wrote:
> There is another school under Sringeri Peetham Management, on the
> Shankara Mutt Road itself, close to the North Road - The Women's
> Peace League School. I am not very sure if this school admits boys.
>
> subrahmanian.v
>
> On 6/29/12, Venkatesh Murthy <vmurthy36-***@public.gmane.org> wrote:
>> Namaste Sri Bhaskar
>>
>> I think you must always use Information Technology in this day and
>> age. I cannot live without Google search. I depend on it very much in
>> my daily life. You can also find all information by Google. Some
>> people say Google is God. He knows everything. If your Admin is
>> preventing Google search it is too bad. He must be like a Rakshasa
>> because he is preventing God into your life. You have to ask God.
>>
>> Sringeri School is Jnanodaya School in Sankara Pura. Address-
>>
>> Bull-temple road, Shankara Park,
>> Shankarapuram, Bangalore - 560004
>>
>> On Fri, Jun 29, 2012 at 9:00 AM, Bhaskar YR <bhaskar.yr-zOhu8KlzJ1LQT0dZR+***@public.gmane.org>
>> wrote:
>>> I studied in a school in bangalore run by the Sringeri Sharada
>>> Peetham. Its a CBSE school affiliated to Delhi.
>>>
>>> praNAms
>>> Hare Krishna
>>>
>>> What is the name of the school & address ?? pls. let me know off the
>>> line.
>>>
>>> Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!
>>> bhaskar
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Archives: http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/archives/advaita-l/
>>> http://blog.gmane.org/gmane.culture.religion.advaita
>>>
>>> To unsubscribe or change your options:
>>> http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/cgi-bin/listinfo/advaita-l
>>>
>>> For assistance, contact:
>>> listmaster-wFjFOH+xtB+LP2KLBgAKiEB+***@public.gmane.org
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Regards
>>
>> -Venkatesh
>> _______________________________________________
>> Archives: http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/archives/advaita-l/
>> http://blog.gmane.org/gmane.culture.religion.advaita
>>
>> To unsubscribe or change your options:
>> http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/cgi-bin/listinfo/advaita-l
>>
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>>
> _______________________________________________
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> http://blog.gmane.org/gmane.culture.religion.advaita
>
> To unsubscribe or change your options:
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>
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>

[Sarma KV]

> There is another school under Sringeri Peetham Management, on the
> Shankara Mutt Road itself, close to the North Road - The Women's
> Peace League School. I am not very sure if this school admits boys.

The only school run completely under Sringeri Sharada Peetham is Jnanodaya
School. It is the second out of the *two* educational institutions run by
the peetham (there is a Jnanodaya PU college also, but it is run from
within J'School campus.)
The other school - the The Women's Peace League School - has a certain
kind of close affiliation only.

See the list under "Educational Activities" in this link:
http://www.sringeri.net/activities.



On Fri, Jun 29, 2012 at 11:09 AM, Abhishek Madhyastha <***@gmail.com
> wrote:

> Jnanodaya School
> (Run by the Sringeri Sharada Peetham),
> Bull temple road, Shankara Park,
> Shankarpuram, B'lore-18
>
> To get a complete picture of the school just open the link below.
>
> http://www.sringeri.net/activities/education/jnanodaya-school
>
> On 6/29/12, V Subrahmanian <***@gmail.com> wrote:
> > There is another school under Sringeri Peetham Management, on the
> > Shankara Mutt Road itself, close to the North Road - The Women's
> > Peace League School. I am not very sure if this school admits boys.
> >
> > subrahmanian.v
> >
> > On 6/29/12, Venkatesh Murthy <***@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> Namaste Sri Bhaskar
> >>
> >> I think you must always use Information Technology in this day and
> >> age. I cannot live without Google search. I depend on it very much in
> >> my daily life. You can also find all information by Google. Some
> >> people say Google is God. He knows everything. If your Admin is
> >> preventing Google search it is too bad. He must be like a Rakshasa
> >> because he is preventing God into your life. You have to ask God.
> >>
> >> Sringeri School is Jnanodaya School in Sankara Pura. Address-
> >>
> >> Bull-temple road, Shankara Park,
> >> Shankarapuram, Bangalore - 560004
> >>
> >> On Fri, Jun 29, 2012 at 9:00 AM, Bhaskar YR <***@in.abb.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>> I studied in a school in bangalore run by the Sringeri Sharada
> >>> Peetham. Its a CBSE school affiliated to Delhi.
> >>>
> >>> praNAms
> >>> Hare Krishna
> >>>
> >>> What is the name of the school & address ?? pls. let me know off the
> >>> line.
> >>>
> >>> Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!
> >>> bhaskar
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Archives: http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/archives/advaita-l/
> >>> http://blog.gmane.org/gmane.culture.religion.advaita
> >>>
> >>> To unsubscribe or change your options:
> >>> http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/cgi-bin/listinfo/advaita-l
> >>>
> >>> For assistance, contact:
> >>> ***@advaita-vedanta.org
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Regards
> >>
> >> -Venkatesh
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Archives: http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/archives/advaita-l/
> >> http://blog.gmane.org/gmane.culture.religion.advaita
> >>
> >> To unsubscribe or change your options:
> >> http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/cgi-bin/listinfo/advaita-l
> >>
> >> For assistance, contact:
> >> ***@advaita-vedanta.org
> >>
> > _______________________________________________
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> > http://blog.gmane.org/gmane.culture.religion.advaita
> >
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--
------------------------------------------------------------------
नगुरोरधिकं नगुरोरधिकं नगुरोरधिकं नगुरोरधिकम्।
शिवशासनतश्शिवशासनतः शिवशासनतश्शिवशासनतः ।।

धन्योस्मि
- श्यामसुन्दर शर्मा
http://anantavaram.blogspot.com
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[Bhaskar YR]

He must be like a Rakshasa
because he is preventing God into your life. You have to ask God.

praNAms
Hare Krishna

Thanks all for the information. Thanks to Sri Venkatesh prabhuji for
suggesting a mild word 'rAkshasa' to address my system admin. authorities
:-)) My mind always thinks worse than this word :-))

Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!
bhaskar